AlbertaBoy12 Posted November 20, 2015 Report Share Posted November 20, 2015 Playing in a loser's bracket tournament in order to win a future teammate? Really guys? Fans would love it, obviously. Just don't expect players to play hard, for some kid to come in and take their job. I would rather see that, then oilers getting 1st over all draft picks every year...haha since it appears they will be in the running again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robrob1974 Posted November 20, 2015 Report Share Posted November 20, 2015 But like guys on the radio were saying about gambling on the planes, players are fiercely competitive and you get a chance to show you're not actually the worst of the bottom bunch. I say it falls right into the casual fans lap. Those will be fans of teams who missed the playoffs. The commentator could keep stressing about the tournament being a loser one, owners get extra revenue, and I don't think it interferes too much with the playoffs. It will only be 1st round and I think the fans of that loser team has something to cheer for. Others will cheer for playoff teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robrob1974 Posted November 20, 2015 Report Share Posted November 20, 2015 Another thing a loser tournament might do is have GMs refrain from gutting the team if they want to win it. They could trade off some expiring contracts, but keep others to help win the tournament. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cross16 Posted November 20, 2015 Report Share Posted November 20, 2015 You actually think fans in a non hockey market are actually going to show up to watch and see if their teams gets a chance at the number one overall pick? You think owners want to subject their players to further injury at the shot of a number one pick? Can you imagine what would happen if someone where to blow a knee out in the tournament. The NHL needs less games, not more. No offence, but having a tournament to decide draft order is IMO a terrible idea that neither the NHL nor the NHLPA would ever agree too. What they have done now is just fine. I know everyone hates that the Oilers won 4 first overal and ya I do too but as i've said for countless years they did it at their own peril. Nubmer 1 picks do not gauarantee future success and look at the Oilers all these years later still trying to teach their young stars the basics of winning. They tanked, but IMO they are paying for it too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robrob1974 Posted November 20, 2015 Report Share Posted November 20, 2015 It was just an idea. I don't think they would. i think it could be exciting though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robrob1974 Posted November 20, 2015 Report Share Posted November 20, 2015 If they want real suspense, What I would really do for draft balls is, weight them oppositely. Set up the machine in front of the camera, pull the balls out one by one. The higher ranked team gets the heaviest balls and will get pulled first. The first out drafts last in order to first overall. Those cards they use now are ridiculous and unentertaining. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyerfan52 Posted November 20, 2015 Report Share Posted November 20, 2015 They could do it in the first round of the playoffs. During off days. Not that they have any... If they did it for the bottom four teams, they would play 2 games... Unless they made the last two teams a 3 game series. Or with an 8 team tournament, I think they'd only need to have 3 game days. Which would be best served at the end of the year . The fans who don't have teams in the playoffs have something to cheer for, owners get some extra "playoff" revenue... 7 games in total, or the final teams can have a 3 game playoff for first overall. I was thinking, they could do only the bottom 8, or have a 6 team round robin, which the four top teams play off afterward. It can be played out during the 1st round of the playoffs. They could do it immediately after the season as playoff teams get 3 or so days off. The main problem I see is players don't get paid for playoffs (other than bonuses if they go deep) but aim for the win. Would the losers be willing to play free if it's only to prove they're not the very worst team especially when the owner is getting extra gate revenue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robrob1974 Posted November 20, 2015 Report Share Posted November 20, 2015 Ya, it sounds like a fun idea, but it wouldn't work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlbertaBoy12 Posted November 20, 2015 Report Share Posted November 20, 2015 They could do it immediately after the season as playoff teams get 3 or so days off. The main problem I see is players don't get paid for playoffs (other than bonuses if they go deep) but aim for the win. Would the losers be willing to play free if it's only to prove they're not the very worst team especially when the owner is getting extra gate revenue? Im kinda left the wondering the same thing, but im wondering how hard you see say the leafs compete to get connor mcdavid before this last draft or other great players. As much as players might not want to lose their jobs by competing I feel like if you said if we win this tournament we get connor mcdavid every player is going to be like wow that could change our team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_People1 Posted November 20, 2015 Report Share Posted November 20, 2015 If they want real suspense, What I would really do for draft balls is, weight them oppositely. Set up the machine in front of the camera, pull the balls out one by one. The higher ranked team gets the heaviest balls and will get pulled first. The first out drafts last in order to first overall. Those cards they use now are ridiculous and unentertaining. Lol Bill Daly flipping over cards is not that entertaining. But I guess Natalie Portman is too expensive to hire for a 5-minute segment on TSN. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flame111 Posted November 30, 2015 Report Share Posted November 30, 2015 So the focus for me now starts to shift to the draft. The Flames should be able to load up this year. D is set for awhile. They will probably trade for G so it will be interesting to see who they get in this years draft. The Flames should be big sellers at the deadline... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlbertaBoy12 Posted November 30, 2015 Report Share Posted November 30, 2015 So the focus for me now starts to shift to the draft. The Flames should be able to load up this year. D is set for awhile. They will probably trade for G so it will be interesting to see who they get in this years draft. The Flames should be big sellers at the deadline... I would probably agree with this the team is too inconsistent at this point, unless there is a huge turn around we should be selling at trade deadline. ( which is what we should have done during the summer or last deadline). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Da4RealDeal Posted November 30, 2015 Report Share Posted November 30, 2015 I am 100% against losing on purpose. With that being said, I am not against getting all the picks we can by selling early. Being one of the first teams to cash in on expiring contracts could prove to be more rewarding than some would admit. To start with if with were to unload Hudler, Russell, Jones, as pending UFA's it could add up to as much as a 1st + 2nds and 3rds. I would not expect the team to use all the picks, trading some of our picks to acquire a goalie in the off season could really help. There is going to be some money in the bank this off season not alot with a few core players to re-up but enough that we could go out on a limb and purchase that top 3-6 forward that could put us over the top. I can see us falling down the standings even further if we were to can or UFA chips in soon. Does that count as a tank? I am not to sure but it is just business in the end anyways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
COZA Posted December 2, 2015 Report Share Posted December 2, 2015 I vote no on losing on purpose, if they took turns handing out the Stanley Cup each team would win once every 30 years. You can't pass up too many chances to win the cup. I do think that the 30 and 29 place teams or maybe a few more than that should forfeit the right to draft first and maybe even second Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted December 2, 2015 Report Share Posted December 2, 2015 Eliminating the opportunity to draft top 5 more than once in a 3 year period would help. 2nd and 3rd year, you go to the end of the non-playoff teams. Eliminates the Oilers and Sabres of recent years. Those teams acted against the spirit of the system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjgallow Posted December 3, 2015 Report Share Posted December 3, 2015 Eliminating the opportunity to draft top 5 more than once in a 3 year period would help. 2nd and 3rd year, you go to the end of the non-playoff teams. Eliminates the Oilers and Sabres of recent years. Those teams acted against the spirit of the system. I think the problem is that the draft isn't reliably working (for some teams). If the draft actually worked for Edmonton/Buffalo, then that Would effectively prevent them from drafting first every year. This has been brought up before: Instead of making up new rules, maybe we should just go back to the original rules (or closer to them). Consider Bumping the age requirement on the draft up a year to 19 from 18. This would: Prevent Edmonton from injuring all of the NHLs best prospects who have more skill than strength Prevent Edmonton from making stupid drafting decisions (ie, Yakupov) and allow players to develop more before being evaluated. Make junior hockey way better Eliminate issues with college free agents (or could be made to do so) All they ever needed to do with Gretzky, imho, is put an exception status in. But at the end of the day, Connor McDavid could be proof that...sure, even the "Next Ones" could be taking an unnecessary risk playing as 18 year olds. Daigle is another example (concussion), and he Never did look right after. So...heck...not even sure about the exception status these days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmac70 Posted December 3, 2015 Report Share Posted December 3, 2015 Eliminating the opportunity to draft top 5 more than once in a 3 year period would help. 2nd and 3rd year, you go to the end of the non-playoff teams. Eliminates the Oilers and Sabres of recent years. Those teams acted against the spirit of the system. I made mention of this a year ago. If the year ended now under the criteria that you and I recommend the Oiler's would draft 15th, and be ineligible to win the lottery. If you look at BUFF and ARZ, they are trending up after a low finish. IMHO once your in the ineligibility category, unless your team trends upward past drafting in the top 10 you may than be eligible to return to lottery status.. I understand that special circumstances may apply but it has not with EDM. Even today you see the lingering effects of stupidity of former MGMT, with EDM. If teams employ idiots than the draft system needs protection from the league to protect its products and image. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jessemadnote39 Posted December 3, 2015 Report Share Posted December 3, 2015 By far the best system I've heard: Most points after elimination from the playoffs. Truly bad teams have more time to gather points (like 10 extra games) and every team has incentive to win no matter what time of the year or where they are in the standings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted December 3, 2015 Report Share Posted December 3, 2015 I think the problem is that the draft isn't reliably working (for some teams). If the draft actually worked for Edmonton/Buffalo, then that Would effectively prevent them from drafting first every year. This has been brought up before: Instead of making up new rules, maybe we should just go back to the original rules (or closer to them). Consider Bumping the age requirement on the draft up a year to 19 from 18. This would: Prevent Edmonton from injuring all of the NHLs best prospects who have more skill than strength Prevent Edmonton from making stupid drafting decisions (ie, Yakupov) and allow players to develop more before being evaluated. Make junior hockey way better Eliminate issues with college free agents (or could be made to do so) All they ever needed to do with Gretzky, imho, is put an exception status in. But at the end of the day, Connor McDavid could be proof that...sure, even the "Next Ones" could be taking an unnecessary risk playing as 18 year olds. Daigle is another example (concussion), and he Never did look right after. So...heck...not even sure about the exception status these days. Rather than raise the draft age, why not raise the playing age to 19. and lower the AHL to the same. That way teams are not forced to have a player go to the NHL or have to play a 4th year in the CHL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_People1 Posted December 3, 2015 Report Share Posted December 3, 2015 I propose, prior to the start of every season, the draft order for the top 14 picks are randomly determined via a non-weighted lottery. like for example, #1 = 24th #2 = 28th #3 = 22nd #4 = 30th #5 = 27th #6 = 19th ....etc The best part of this is it removes lottery rigging conspiracies. It's also very difficult to tank for, say 24th best record in the league because you actually do need a decent team that can win you some games. Basically, just play to win and where you end up drafting is where you draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cross16 Posted December 3, 2015 Report Share Posted December 3, 2015 I've long been in favor of raising the draft age. IMO, it should be 20. You can play 16-20 in CHL/NCAA/Internationally get drafted and then its off to pro hockey. YOu don't have to worry about assignements etc and also at that point if you are NCAA you'd have to declare to be drafted or remain in school. Its never going to happen becuase you'd have to overhaul so much of the system and other leagues and I think this would be very dangerous for the CHL but in a perfect world that's how I would do it. i think at 20 you'd known more about who you are drafting and you lower, but not drastically reduce, the chances of a bust. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_People1 Posted December 3, 2015 Report Share Posted December 3, 2015 I've long been in favor of raising the draft age. IMO, it should be 20. You can play 16-20 in CHL/NCAA/Internationally get drafted and then its off to pro hockey. YOu don't have to worry about assignements etc and also at that point if you are NCAA you'd have to declare to be drafted or remain in school. Its never going to happen becuase you'd have to overhaul so much of the system and other leagues and I think this would be very dangerous for the CHL but in a perfect world that's how I would do it. i think at 20 you'd known more about who you are drafting and you lower, but not drastically reduce, the chances of a bust. I think it has more to do with kids hitting the legal age at 18 and therefore cannot legally be discriminated to work based on age. At least, that's what I believe to be true in Canada. (I haven't been 18 for a long time so I'm not sure what the labour laws in Canada are nowadays.) But ya, 20 would be a number I'm looking at as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cross16 Posted December 3, 2015 Report Share Posted December 3, 2015 I think it has more to do with kids hitting the legal age at 18 and therefore cannot legally be discriminated to work based on age. At least, that's what I believe to be true in Canada. (I haven't been 18 for a long time so I'm not sure what the labour laws in Canada are nowadays.) But ya, 20 would be a number I'm looking at as well. I'm no labor lawyer but I don't beleive thats the case. First off I'm pretty sure they orginally changed to rule to compete with the WHA (who started drafting 18 year old) and the CFL does not, and is not allowed, draft anyone who is 18 years old. Now mind you the CFL rule is that players must have a certain amout of "years of eligibility" as opposed to be a certain age so maybe you are right and thats how they get around that. So if you are right and it is a labor law thing perhaps the can amend it to something like minimum 2 playing years or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmac70 Posted December 3, 2015 Report Share Posted December 3, 2015 By far the best system I've heard: Most points after elimination from the playoffs. Truly bad teams have more time to gather points (like 10 extra games) and every team has incentive to win no matter what time of the year or where they are in the standings. That system only makes sense for teams not in a rebuild. When a team is gutted at the trade deadline on a designed rebuild how can one stay competitive. The teams that try to make change should not be punished for clubs that lack the ability to put good hockey people in place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robrob1974 Posted December 3, 2015 Report Share Posted December 3, 2015 That system only makes sense for teams not in a rebuild. When a team is gutted at the trade deadline on a designed rebuild how can one stay competitive. The teams that try to make change should not be punished for clubs that lack the ability to put good hockey people in place. What about most points after the Trade deadline among the bottom group of teams in the league. 14 teams don't make it. Roughly how many are still fighting for a spot. Those are cusp teams that don't necessarily need a top pick. That leaves about the bottom 5 teams. if you give the #1 record of those teams after the deadline, they win the pick? Just adding to the suggestion... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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