robrob74 Posted March 23, 2013 Report Share Posted March 23, 2013 I don't disagree that Edwards and King put their fair share of input into hockey ops. But I don't believe they are completely at fault for the current on ice product. We are where we are not because we haven't traded our superstars yet, but because in the span of '04 to '09 we have only drafted 2 current roster players. And I don't think top management acts like Al Davis on draft day, so why blame them for atrocious drafting. Then what you're saying is, retool the scouts. GM's are drafting the players, but they rely on the scouts to give them information on the many different players in the draft. There's no doubting we need to draft a lot better. We'd been drafting poorly before '04. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wreckening Posted March 23, 2013 Report Share Posted March 23, 2013 What has me really wondering what's going on lately is Feaster's lack of media presence. Can anything be made of this or am I just reading into it too much? It seemed earlier in the year we heard from him more often than we are now. Either something is coming down the pipe or he just doesn't have answers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDeeds Posted March 23, 2013 Report Share Posted March 23, 2013 What has me really wondering what's going on lately is Feaster's lack of media presence. Can anything be made of this or am I just reading into it too much? It seemed earlier in the year we heard from him more often than we are now. Either something is coming down the pipe or he just doesn't have answers. When your audience is hostile, you appear to have just screwed up(RoR), you have nothing enlightening or uplifting to say at this time, then is it little wonder you have not heard from him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDeeds Posted March 23, 2013 Report Share Posted March 23, 2013 I don't disagree that Edwards and King put their fair share of input into hockey ops. But I don't believe they are completely at fault for the current on ice product. We are where we are not because we haven't traded our superstars yet, but because in the span of '04 to '09 we have only drafted 2 current roster players. And I don't think top management acts like Al Davis on draft day, so why blame them for atrocious drafting. Well if you read my post I didn't say firing Feaster would solve the problem. In fact if you are going to just get another yes man there is little reason to fire him. As for the drafting part of your post where did I ever blame drafting? I made one post in another thread where I could see the logic in trading away second round picks for a NHL player if the rate of 2nd rounders making the NHL is around 10%. I remember that post and mentioned it causes problems with age voids in your lineup if you do it too often. I have never blamed them for atrocious drafting. I posted those links because it was mentioned Feaster left the Lightning because of meddling from Ownership. I only made the comment and posted the links to show we(Flames) aren't nearly comparable to that situation back then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s4xon Posted March 23, 2013 Report Share Posted March 23, 2013 People keep calling for Feaster's head, but you need a contingency plan. How would Weisbrod fare as the GM? He's only been a pro scout in his professional career with the Stars and the Bruins, and eventually became the Director of Scouting with the Bruins 2 years later. He has stepped up even further to Assistant GM of Player Personnel with the Flames. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Weisbrod#NHL_Executive So far he has a great track record in picks like Johnny Hockey, Sven Baertschi, Gilles, Brossoit, and so far Jankowski. Of course we won't actually know until they make the Flames, but things are looking very positive the drafting as of late. I'm not sure if he would be ready for the role as there is much more to deal with as a GM, but he does seem to know his players. Thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wreckening Posted March 23, 2013 Report Share Posted March 23, 2013 When your audience is hostile, you appear to have just screwed up(RoR), you have nothing enlightening or uplifting to say at this time, then is it little wonder you have not heard from him? True enough......I'm probably just looking for anything to grasp on to in as far as answers go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lordxan Posted March 23, 2013 Report Share Posted March 23, 2013 True enough......I'm probably just looking for anything to grasp on to in as far as answers go. Answers: 1. Team culture needs to change 2. Team age is too old 3. Team Brass is afraid of change 4. The longer this inaction goes on the longer it will take to fix I think that about sums up the answers you are looking for, or we could go like this: 1. Team sucks Either way, at this point I don't think we need Feaster to tell us this and that he has no answers for the problem If he did he'd be making moves and having more media exposure. It's going to be a long rebuild because of the unwillingness to make the tough decisions a few years back. I wish Feaster was good to his word last year when he threatened to blow it all up. It's looking more and more like he should have then, may have had some room to make moves. Now I fear most teams are: 1. Not interested in our players at all 2. Will under value the players we have and we get a crap return 3. Bit of both 1 and 2 Either way looking to be dark times for this team for a few years till we see if our young recent talent can make it in the NHL...Sucks painting yourself into a corner and that is exactly where the Flames are now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cross16 Posted March 23, 2013 Report Share Posted March 23, 2013 People keep calling for Feaster's head, but you need a contingency plan. How would Weisbrod fare as the GM? He's only been a pro scout in his professional career with the Stars and the Bruins, and eventually became the Director of Scouting with the Bruins 2 years later. He has stepped up even further to Assistant GM of Player Personnel with the Flames. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Weisbrod#NHL_Executive So far he has a great track record in picks like Johnny Hockey, Sven Baertschi, Gilles, Brossoit, and so far Jankowski. Of course we won't actually know until they make the Flames, but things are looking very positive the drafting as of late. I'm not sure if he would be ready for the role as there is much more to deal with as a GM, but he does seem to know his players. Thoughts? Weisbrod was in Boston when Flames drafted Gaudreau. Now to his credit he wanted him in Boston too but he wasn't responsible for the Flames drafting him, nor was he responsible for Baertschi. Weisbrod joined after the draft in 2011. I don't think he is ready to be a GM, IMO. I like having him in the organization but i'd like to see him stay as the Ast GM for a little longer and keep running drafts. I think a contingency plan for the Flames is starting them right in the face in Brian Burke. YOu mean not like him personally but the fact is the guy has rebuilt 3 teams into playoff/contending teams with how well Toronto is doing right now. Honestly I can't think of someone more perfect to run the franchise for where they are heading over the next couple of years with his experience and also he has no fear to make the moves that are the best interest of the franchise. I defended Feaster earlier in the thread but I cna't anymore. IMO, Feater has done a terrible job as GM and with having such a qualified candidate as Brian Burke I see no reason to keep Feaster around. Obviously he has to stay to at least past the deadline but going forward I don't want to see Feaster trying to rebuild this team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wreckening Posted March 23, 2013 Report Share Posted March 23, 2013 Weisbrod was in Boston when Flames drafted Gaudreau. Now to his credit he wanted him in Boston too but he wasn't responsible for the Flames drafting him, nor was he responsible for Baertschi. Weisbrod joined after the draft in 2011. I don't think he is ready to be a GM, IMO. I like having him in the organization but i'd like to see him stay as the Ast GM for a little longer and keep running drafts. I think a contingency plan for the Flames is starting them right in the face in Brian Burke. YOu mean not like him personally but the fact is the guy has rebuilt 3 teams into playoff/contending teams with how well Toronto is doing right now. Honestly I can't think of someone more perfect to run the franchise for where they are heading over the next couple of years with his experience and also he has no fear to make the moves that are the best interest of the franchise. I defended Feaster earlier in the thread but I cna't anymore. IMO, Feater has done a terrible job as GM and with having such a qualified candidate as Brian Burke I see no reason to keep Feaster around. Obviously he has to stay to at least past the deadline but going forward I don't want to see Feaster trying to rebuild this team. My biggest fear with hiring Burke as GM is that he may want his buddy Ron Wilson to coach. That being said however I would be ok with Burke pulling the strings. I just don't know if the owners could handle him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kehatch Posted March 23, 2013 Report Share Posted March 23, 2013 Weisbrod was in Boston when Flames drafted Gaudreau. Now to his credit he wanted him in Boston too but he wasn't responsible for the Flames drafting him, nor was he responsible for Baertschi. Weisbrod joined after the draft in 2011. I don't think he is ready to be a GM, IMO. I like having him in the organization but i'd like to see him stay as the Ast GM for a little longer and keep running drafts. I think a contingency plan for the Flames is starting them right in the face in Brian Burke. YOu mean not like him personally but the fact is the guy has rebuilt 3 teams into playoff/contending teams with how well Toronto is doing right now. Honestly I can't think of someone more perfect to run the franchise for where they are heading over the next couple of years with his experience and also he has no fear to make the moves that are the best interest of the franchise. I defended Feaster earlier in the thread but I cna't anymore. IMO, Feater has done a terrible job as GM and with having such a qualified candidate as Brian Burke I see no reason to keep Feaster around. Obviously he has to stay to at least past the deadline but going forward I don't want to see Feaster trying to rebuild this team. Burke might be the best guy available. But I didn't like him in Toronto. He decided to forgo a rebuild to attempt to get into contention quickly. He failed in that attempt. They were near the bottom his entire time in Toronto. Even now they are a fringe NHL team at best and could be in real trouble with Phaneuf and Kessel free agents after next season. One of the reasons they are doing well is because of the emergency of Kadri. A guy that Burke considered trading numerous times and who he (and his coach) failed to show any confidence in. His decision to build around Phaneuf and Kessel was a poor one IMO. As was sticking with Wilson as long as he did. Losing out on Hamilton and Seguin was a massive blow to the franchise (though there was some bad luck there). Plus, Burke wasn't able to make the big trades his last while in Toronto. In large part because he wasn't willing to pay the rising costs that the NHL parody has created. You can applaud him for his patience I suppose. But Burke's best skill is his horse trading. Take that away and what is left? There are things I like about Burke. And I wouldn't hate it if he was the GM. I would pick him 10 times out of 10 times over Feaster. But I don't know if he is the best option for Calgary's situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_People1 Posted March 23, 2013 Report Share Posted March 23, 2013 As for Fire Feaster I don't know if he is the right man for the Flames from the point of view that the direction of the team seems to be invisible. I see a collection of small skilled players who are unable to get it done. Why? Take your pick: -Poor D play. -Inferior goaltending. -Overall small team easy to push around. -I don't see the professionalism here a club full of vets should have. I am pretty sure that Feaster is pretty much the Owners yes man, so honestly I don't see him able to change things of importance. Then again you replace Feaster, ask yourself what do you replace him with? another yes man that will just do the Owners bidding? Too many lawyers and marketers seasoning this stew and not enough cooks with experience. The direction is actually very visible. It's just not very "effective". It's not winning games. From Feaster's earlier moves, like Regehr for Byron, it's clear he wants to go smaller, faster, and more skilled. In theory, that could work but it hasn't translated well on the ice. Reality is, too much of the game is played in the corners and around the boards where you need muscle. Size also offers natural defensive benefits such as a longer reach with the stick and stronger play in the crease area. The Flames lack this severely. The Flames are a great team on the rush and we've scored some seriously pretty goals this season so to borrow a famous Diablo 3 quote, "it's working as intended." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s4xon Posted March 25, 2013 Report Share Posted March 25, 2013 Good or bad, why do I have this pressing feeling that this last few weeks of the season, along with the draft, will be Feaster's legacy with the Flames? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carty Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 Good or bad, why do I have this pressing feeling that this last few weeks of the season, along with the draft, will be Feaster's legacy with the Flames? I think that starting with what moves are done by the upcoming trade deadline, and up to what happens at the draft this July, will either define Feaster as a worthy GM, or possibly (and rightfully so if he screws it up) be the beginning of his downfall... He could surprise me and also prove me wrong, but at this point in time I am not sure that I have enough trust in him to make the right decisions during such an important time for the team... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s4xon Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 I think that starting with what moves are done by the upcoming trade deadline, and up to what happens at the draft this July, will either define Feaster as a worthy GM, or possibly (and rightfully so if he screws it up) be the beginning of his downfall... He could surprise me and also prove me wrong, but at this point in time I am not sure that I have enough trust in him to make the right decisions during such an important time for the team... I don't know Carty, I just have this uneasy feeling....like something big is coming. I don't know whether it's good or bad. Feaster has surprised me with some positive things, and others have me shaking my head. Maybe the contrast of the two is giving me the indication that this upcoming delicate situation defines the Flames for another 6-8 years, which is basically sourcing my unease. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDeeds Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 I "almost" wish the RoR thing would have been allowed to play out for us. We would know if what Feaster claimed in his statement was true by now. Instead we are now left with speculation on what might have been. That is like claiming the bright prospect in Junior is guaranteed to be the next Hall of Fame <Insert whatever position here> I have always been a tad sceptical on Feaster. I don't mind some of his attempted moves even the mortgaging the farm for Brad Richards but for someone who complained so hard about cap space jail he has since seemed eager to spend any and all of what cap space he has been given. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s4xon Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 I "almost" wish the RoR thing would have been allowed to play out for us. We would know if what Feaster claimed in his statement was true by now. Instead we are now left with speculation on what might have been. That is like claiming the bright prospect in Junior is guaranteed to be the next Hall of Fame <Insert whatever position here> I have always been a tad sceptical on Feaster. I don't mind some of his attempted moves even the mortgaging the farm for Brad Richards but for someone who complained so hard about cap space jail he has since seemed eager to spend any and all of what cap space he has been given. I agree Deeds, the RoR just left a bitter taste in my mouth. No one really can say for sure what the end result was...If Feaster knew what he was doing, or if it was a blind mistake. This upcoming situtation is delicate. Is he going to approach it as such? Or, is it business as usual? It's hard to read the guy. Edit: At least with Dutter, we knew the outcome. We knew once a trade happened the Flames lost Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thanos316 Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 If the whole thing doesn't result in a slew of draft picks and/or prospects that are ready to compete at the NHL level within the next two to three years the it'll probably mean that the Flames got jobbed again. I'm not saying I expect a team full of kids to win the Cup by 2016, but they have to be good enough that when they get here they stay here and not be the types of players who end up doing the back-and-forth to-and-from Abbotsford. Whoever goes, and at this stage I'm ready to accept blowing up the entire team core and purging all of the bit players if that's what it takes to get on the path to become competitive again, we have to see real long-term and valuable players coming back in return. If it's just a case of getting rid of Iggy/Kipper/Bouw/whoever for more stop-gap measures then the entire exercise will be pointless and it'll show, once again, that the upper management isn't going to commit to a massive shift in the franchise's thinking that desperately has to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDeeds Posted March 26, 2013 Report Share Posted March 26, 2013 If the whole thing doesn't result in a slew of draft picks and/or prospects that are ready to compete at the NHL level within the next two to three years the it'll probably mean that the Flames got jobbed again. I'm not saying I expect a team full of kids to win the Cup by 2016, but they have to be good enough that when they get here they stay here and not be the types of players who end up doing the back-and-forth to-and-from Abbotsford. Whoever goes, and at this stage I'm ready to accept blowing up the entire team core and purging all of the bit players if that's what it takes to get on the path to become competitive again, we have to see real long-term and valuable players coming back in return. If it's just a case of getting rid of Iggy/Kipper/Bouw/whoever for more stop-gap measures then the entire exercise will be pointless and it'll show, once again, that the upper management isn't going to commit to a massive shift in the franchise's thinking that desperately has to happen. Those bit players you so quickly want the team to get rid of are the same players who kept us in the running last season, when we experienced all those injuries. Most teams don't call them fringe or bit players, they call it depth. They are extremely important to have around and you really only notice it when you don't have any to call upon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thanos316 Posted March 27, 2013 Report Share Posted March 27, 2013 That might have been true of previous years when the depth players held the team in the hunt until the bitter end but it hasn't been this year where the entire team has been mostly mediocre. Except for Kipper and Backlund, and perhaps Iggy's rumoured injury of a few weeks ago, there hasn't been an injury excuse to fall back on to explain this year at all. At this stage about the only legitimate reason for this year's failure that I'm willing to accept is that the shortened season combined with no pre-season at all crippled this team because, as opposed to other stronger teams that have much more skill that they can rely on, the Flames desperately needed the pre-season and Oct/Nov/Dec to get into any sort of competitive shape. Other than that all we really know as a provable fact is that this version of the Flames is not at a level that can convincingly compete, in either the short- or long-term, with most of the other teams in the NHL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDeeds Posted March 27, 2013 Report Share Posted March 27, 2013 That might have been true of previous years when the depth players held the team in the hunt until the bitter end but it hasn't been this year where the entire team has been mostly mediocre. Except for Kipper and Backlund, and perhaps Iggy's rumoured injury of a few weeks ago, there hasn't been an injury excuse to fall back on to explain this year at all. At this stage about the only legitimate reason for this year's failure that I'm willing to accept is that the shortened season combined with no pre-season at all crippled this team because, as opposed to other stronger teams that have much more skill that they can rely on, the Flames desperately needed the pre-season and Oct/Nov/Dec to get into any sort of competitive shape. Other than that all we really know as a provable fact is that this version of the Flames is not at a level that can convincingly compete, in either the short- or long-term, with most of the other teams in the NHL. This team does not need or use excuses. You the fan are welcome to parade out as many excuses as you want to explain or justify a poor season. How about despite what seemed like some nice improvements on paper, this years Flames just weren't good enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louis23 Posted March 28, 2013 Report Share Posted March 28, 2013 If the return is true, Feaster just pulled a Milbury on us. Let's ship him to CBC with love and be done with this guy already. (If this is true) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carty Posted March 28, 2013 Report Share Posted March 28, 2013 If the return is accurate... Conditional 1st round pick my chicken tikka masala... Feaster is an idiot!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ifiwaschucknorris Posted March 28, 2013 Report Share Posted March 28, 2013 I REALLY dislike the conditional 1st rounder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FueltheFlames1075 Posted March 28, 2013 Report Share Posted March 28, 2013 If the conditional 1st is true, the Flames really need to look at actually firing Feaster. To me it is a sign that he cannot hold his own in trade talks in which he should be able to. Just my two cents though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louis23 Posted March 28, 2013 Report Share Posted March 28, 2013 For love's sake, do NOT let Feaster trade Bouwmeester and possibly Kiprusoff. Hire Burke or someone, get FEASTER FAR AWAY from us. ASAP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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