conundrumed

No one suggested the coach gets a free pass and no accountability. All accountability is now on the GM. Fair enough.

Impartial to the firing, but the roster is currently a mess. Hence the hairy eyeball lol.

You're good DD, I'll give you that. I agree with your points, but it's probably time to move on. With the hairy eyeball on BT of course...

Not suggesting Lehtonen, but if a buyout makes him a $1.5 1B, why not? Still leaves cash to further the position. He may be up and down, but he stole games in the 2nd rd of the playoffs when Dallas was under siege. Everyone's focusing on what he didn't do, but you have to look at what he did do.

Keep listening to the talking heads... The only reason Dallas was involved in a game 7 was because Lehtonen stole 2 games. Lehtonen isn't better, A LOT BETTER, than Ramo? Yeah sure, whatever. The way Dallas played, they deserved to be swept. But he had a bad game 7, that makes him horrible. Listen to analysts much? There shouldn't have even been a game 7 the way Dallas played. So I guess you could say Lehtonen brought this on himself for stealing 2 games single-handedly. At what point is the roster letting their goalie down?

Okay! I'm guessing at one or 2 of our 2nds gets a goalie. Our 6th oa is untouchable in exchange for a goalie. I agree the price is lower than even a mid 1st rounder for sure.

Like beating a dead horse innit! I have no problem getting rid of Hartley, for clarification. Treliving just should have chosen his words more carefully. The "he's taken this team as far as he can", for me, is underhanded to almost malicious. You can call it nitpicking, but if your a pro GM, you need to know what implications that will raise in the media and for Hartley's future employ. Most GM's stick to, "we want to go in another direction" and they stick to that for a reason. Keep it professional is all I'd have wanted to see from our GM. Don't feed the lions. Especially if it's the team you're managing and has holes as big as the sky. Outside of that, BT, carry on, no problem. And as far as the players not liking him rumours, I'd love to know which ones, because I'm guessing the underperformers and not good enough ones, god knows we have enough of those. It's 23 different personalities to motivate. I pay that rumour no mind, that is every coach in the league.

A Lehtonen buyout is possible, which would get him for us cheap. We're still buying time to "fix" the position.

Right. Okay, it's coaching. We have more high end talent than Winnipeg? When did that happen? Scheifele=Monahan. Care to break down the rest? Being a homer doesn't make us better than a lot of our roster being crap. Maye Ferland is Lucic, maybe Colborne is Franzen. Guess what? They aren't.

That's little consolation. Yet, why do you think that? Winnipeg and Columbus look a lot better to me, the Oilers look close. Arizona has a ton of young depth. How are we in better shape? Not to mention, those teams have goalies. I love how we treat that as, yeah but... Yeah but what? It's a huge issue. Huge.

But it's true. The roster is not very good. There are some nice pieces, sure. But it isn't a roster that gets you to the playoffs.

Actually pretty much yeah. How we got Raymond at such a great price, I don't know, talk to BT lol. Have a luv in lol.

What? Those guys are just happy to keep playing lol. They're not exactly holding the cards lol. "A bunch of cap", lol. 3 yrs? Man you trippin', it's the bottom of the UFA list under 2.2 mil rofl

Consensus is over-rated boss, hence, discussion and disagreement. Turns out, everything you thought was right is wrong lol. I hate when that happens!

They are UFA. He's now telling us how we want to be harder to play against, he's done next to zero in that regard for 2 years.

How about, "He's taken this team as far as I think he can". So much for being a "classy" org. Let's see how far BT can take it.

Not sure how I'm biased. For/Against who?

It's looking like, for Bouma money or less per: M. Richards Travis Moen Vernon Fiddler Jason Chimera Jarrett Stoll Trevor Lewis *perhaps* Alex Tanguay Scott Upshall Not one of these is over 2 yrs, yet most of them provide a "black and blue" haha, j/k. But they provide a backbone for our young guys, so to speak. None of these guys will lead your team in scoring, but they've played a lot of NHL. They're the type of players, mainly, that keep you honest, good or bad, been there done that.

"A bunch of resources" are low risk, low contract experienced NHLers to help the young guys along and to buy time from everyone judging our prospect development. You're confusing it with trading off the future for vets. You can sign a vet quite easily at ufa and lose nothing for the rebuild. There's great cheap ones that don't show up on the score sheet but sure make you a hard team. The young guys need more than 2 or 3 of those around them imho.

Alright, run with that thinking, I'll wait to see what he improves this offseason. We'll see what he does, but while you write everything off to something else, I have huge question marks. No harm, no foul.

You keep telling me what I'm hung up on, then tell me to tone it down? For what? How's the kool-aid? C'mon kehatch, I'm being critical of BT is all, call it an island if you like, but someone has to be. Do I mind the BH firing? Not much. Do I like BT's comments on it? Not really. Did I expect a great team last year? No. Now in all of this, I know BT inherited players. He added Hamilton and Frolik, The Russell deal was good. I'm good with that. He gave BH the 3 headed G monster no coach would ever want. He started the tenure filling holes that he only perceived, and he perceived wrong. There's 2 main things imho that hurts everything in the lineup including PP and PK. We all know about goaltending, which he's spent 2 yrs doing zero to address. Now we are completely desperate. The other is faceoffs. Want a better PP, PK? Win a faceoff, it's not a big secret. Where's the $1m Vernon Fiddler's? They're out there. So while you scour around other leagues hoping for Nakladl's Morrisson's and Pribyl's, shed salaries and feel free to not neglect cheap 10 yr vets that have been regulars in this league and easily give you 8-12 minutes a night in any role. Want to be hard to play against? Where's your cheap Upshall's and Moen's? Brandon Bollig is all you did, worst of the bunch. It feels like Feaster to me, making it complicated. At least we're in the least penalized in the league, because we're soft. I'm not hung up on "black and blue", I'm offended by it. The answer is Bollig and Engelland? That's 2 yrs ago, he's done zero to add that definition since. Someone has to be critical, blast away.

Oh please. Was the poor season unexpected? You are definitely taking the wrong road. Who is responsible for goalie contracts? Who signed Raymond and Engelland at 3 per? Who signed Bouma for $2.2? Backlund at $3.5? We want to be a black and blue team now? Maybe don't take 2 yrs to let us know that, because we wouldn't know that direction so far...

Well at least I know what I'm hung up on now. I thought it was the roster. How's the kool-aid, is it Black and Blue?

I'm with cheers, this year was a testament to how "good" this team actually is. Not very. Goal was Treliving's fault and still is. The rest of the roster is too. "he took the team as far as he could. He took YOUR team as far as god almighty could.

Unfortunately he isn't the mgr, and Bennett alone does not get you Gibson AND Vatenen/Fowler. That's a tall order that would get a ton of interest = overpayment. Media discussing random thoughts...