CastleMania Posted July 1, 2015 Report Share Posted July 1, 2015 Gio is coming back from a big injury. Let's see how he plays before we start trying to sign him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cccsberg Posted July 1, 2015 Report Share Posted July 1, 2015 Go strikes me as a guy who's "team-first" and would be willing to sign for term and lower dollars. Not sure why I think that because his last contract impasse led to him going to the KHL for a year. I'm not too concerned about the injury, I think we need to get him signed asap and hope to hear something shortly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going4TheCup Posted July 2, 2015 Report Share Posted July 2, 2015 Mark Giordano had a great year and if he didn't get injured last season I think he would have won the James Norris Memorial Trophy. That being said how much is Giordano worth? is he worth 9 million a year? To me it seems a little too much and would hurt our salary cap especially since we would have to sign our restricted free agents like Gaudreau and Monahan next season. Would any type of trade be acceptable? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SiouX_17 Posted July 2, 2015 Report Share Posted July 2, 2015 Go strikes me as a guy who's "team-first" and would be willing to sign for term and lower dollars. Not sure why I think that because his last contract impasse led to him going to the KHL for a year. I'm not too concerned about the injury, I think we need to get him signed asap and hope to hear something shortly. finally a comment I was expecting here much sooner.. he said it in one of his interviews, that he`d like to retire as a Calgary Flame [bob Hartley said it too], being this team his final stop .. I just can`t see how he would preffer huge money over the team that HE literally turned around by being such a great leader and role model.. no, I expect him to give this team what you call a hometown discount and get signed, let`s say, for 7-8 years [ he would still retire, if he felt he doesn`t catch up anymore.. he is honest not just to this organization, but to himself, too, so he would do it as an man of honour]..that`s where I see him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTech780 Posted July 2, 2015 Report Share Posted July 2, 2015 This deal needs to get done before the start of the season, if it drags on into the season it will become a distraction. The first question anyone from the team will get asked from the media will be about Giordano's contract, will he get traded. It would be a huge mistake to have a young team that accomplished all that it did last year be subject to such a distraction. I think it is unfair expect Giordano to take a home town discount, he is person with a family why shouldn't he get the most money possible. Even if he does take a hometown discount, we will be paying him $7+ million AAV on a 6+ year contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cross16 Posted July 2, 2015 Report Share Posted July 2, 2015 100% agree Jtech. The other reason I would add its better to get this deal done sooner rather then later is because its going to be their biggest cap hit, in all likelihood. So until you know the numbers its really tough to think about extensions for guys like Hudler (if even possible) Monahan, Gaudreau etc. Its proper team planning I think to make sure you get your biggest fish locked up quickly and as soon as you possible can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDeeds Posted July 2, 2015 Report Share Posted July 2, 2015 Well if he had not been hurt and gone on to be the Norris finalist/runaway winner he was predicted to be... We would not know we can play without him. Would you guys be more inclined to give him the 9 m/season if this was the case?? BT has gotten a bunch of value signings lately so... Get him signed now while he is still cheaper than he would have been.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ABC923 Posted July 2, 2015 Report Share Posted July 2, 2015 I too think Gio will take a somewhat friendly deal that pays him well, while taking into account where he is at in his career. When he is signed, I think it is important Gio be the highest paid player on the team at that time. Hamilton is currently tops on the blueline at 5.75 AAV, so he should be higher than that. I'm thinking a 6 year deal, AAV around 6.75 with a bit of backdiving (8, 7.5, 7, 6.5, 6, 5.5). That will bring Gio to 39 years of age, at which point he will likely retire. We don't want to go much farther, since an early retirement will still subject us to some cap recapture (i think?). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlamesLogic Posted July 2, 2015 Report Share Posted July 2, 2015 I too think Gio will take a somewhat friendly deal that pays him well, while taking into account where he is at in his career. When he is signed, I think it is important Gio be the highest paid player on the team at that time. Hamilton is currently tops on the blueline at 5.75 AAV, so he should be higher than that. I'm thinking a 6 year deal, AAV around 6.75 with a bit of backdiving (8, 7.5, 7, 6.5, 6, 5.5). That will bring Gio to 39 years of age, at which point he will likely retire. We don't want to go much farther, since an early retirement will still subject us to some cap recapture (i think?). No only if he signs the deal after he is 35.If you are doing a long term deal its best to put a bunch of low dollar values at the end. Something like 8 8 6 6 4 4 4 4 taking him to 40 with an AAV of 5.5z Imo just extend him one or two years at 8-9M because a) his agent loses leverage once he is 35 and the first year dollar value harshly limits a value retirement contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
420since1974 Posted July 2, 2015 Report Share Posted July 2, 2015 While his injury decimated his chances to win the James Norris Memorial Trophy, it may ultimately save the Calgary Flames around $1M per season on his next contract. I feel that Giordano will be happy as long as he becomes the highest paid Flame when he re-signs. 5 or 6 years would be the term I'd offer. If he demands over $7M/yr, I'd try like hell to avoid a NMC or NTC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyerfan52 Posted July 2, 2015 Report Share Posted July 2, 2015 Adding Dougie Hamilton changed the complextion of his ask. With Hamilton, Brodie, Wideman & Russell that's 4 pretty good D. That decreases the need part. Last week I was OK with a higher $ & term but given the circumstances I'd try 7 x 5 or 6.5 x 6. In either case run the $s the same in every year to eliminate the chance of a recapture should he opt to retire or substain a career ending injury so we don't have to do a Pronger/Savard type farce. The $s are big enough to cover current worth if seen as overpayments in the later years when he probably doesn't merit it. He might be worth 9 in the short term now but for every year added past the 3 the $s should decrease as @ 36+ he'll likely be worth much less. If we went 9 x 3, 6, 4 & 3 (not allowed but an example of changing value) we've got 6.67 average over 6 years. If he wants 8-9 average go short term & see what he'll be able to ask in 3 years. His last 82 game season was 2010-11 so injuries do mount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kehatch Posted July 3, 2015 Report Share Posted July 3, 2015 I think the Flames can trade Giordano if they want to now. I am not suggesting they will or should. But the option gives them leverage. I am sure Giordano wants to stay. But Winter is his agent. Go to just about any contentious negotiation and Winter is probably the agent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robrob1974 Posted July 3, 2015 Report Share Posted July 3, 2015 Well if he had not been hurt and gone on to be the Norris finalist/runaway winner he was predicted to be... We would not know we can play without him. Would you guys be more inclined to give him the 9 m/season if this was the case?? BT has gotten a bunch of value signings lately so... Get him signed now while he is still cheaper than he would have been.... I am with you. But I hope he is closer to the 7M than 8+. I think some of these big contracts don't work in the salary cap era and need to be toned down a bit. They're probably worth it, but the way they handcuff a team, it just doesn't make sense to me. i know 6.5 is low, but I wish it was closer to that. If he wants higher, do it on a two or three year.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KACaribou Posted July 3, 2015 Report Share Posted July 3, 2015 I don't think this is going to end well. $9 million? That puts a wedge in the middle of the team. We like and want Gio but he is less important than Johnny Hockey, Monahan and Bennett. Now that we have Hamilton, and with Brodie improving every single year, what pressure will be on Gio to be not just better than those two D, but significantly better at $9 million. I doubt very much he can be that much better, and Hamilton and Brodie's ceiling is higher than Gio at his best - in other words now! If $9 million is serious or even correct, and with Winter as his agent I have no reason to believe it isn't, bye bye Gio. You're not Bobby Orr. Quit reading your own press clippings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kehatch Posted July 3, 2015 Report Share Posted July 3, 2015 There is one D getting over 8 million today. You can't pay that to a guy that will be 33 when his contract starts and who averaged just over 60 games per season the last 2 seasons. Even Giordano. Fortunately things are working in our favour. We have Hamilton so we don't need to keep Giordano. Plus, the cap hasn't went up much and isn't projected to next season. Teams aren't handing out crazy contracts. Nobody is paying Giordano 8+ on a term contract next summer. Winter is a pain, but he isn't stupid. Gio wants to stay here. He also wants to win here, not shackle the team. A deal will get done that works for both parties. If I am the Flames, my "walk away" number is 7.5 x 5. Maybe even 7 x 4. If you can't get there you trade him. That isn't a threat to force a bargain. It is what we can afford to pay him, take it or leave it. I don't think this is going to end well. $9 million? That puts a wedge in the middle of the team. We like and want Gio but he is less important than Johnny Hockey, Monahan and Bennett. Now that we have Hamilton, and with Brodie improving every single year, what pressure will be on Gio to be not just better than those two D, but significantly better at $9 million. I doubt very much he can be that much better, and Hamilton and Brodie's ceiling is higher than Gio at his best - in other words now! If $9 million is serious or even correct, and with Winter as his agent I have no reason to believe it isn't, bye bye Gio. You're not Bobby Orr. Quit reading your own press clippings. Way to over react on hearsay and limited info. Giordano deserves better then this type of rant. He has done nothing to deserve that. Shame on you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted July 3, 2015 Report Share Posted July 3, 2015 There is one D getting over 8 million today. You can't pay that to a guy that will be 33 when his contract starts and who averaged just over 60 games per season the last 2 seasons. Even Giordano. Fortunately things are working in our favour. We have Hamilton so we don't need to keep Giordano. Plus, the cap hasn't went up much and isn't projected to next season. Teams aren't handing out crazy contracts. Nobody is paying Giordano 8+ on a term contract next summer. Winter is a pain, but he isn't stupid. Gio wants to stay here. He also wants to win here, not shackle the team. A deal will get done that works for both parties. If I am the Flames, my "walk away" number is 7.5 x 5. Maybe even 7 x 4. If you can't get there you trade him. That isn't a threat to force a bargain. It is what we can afford to pay him, take it or leave it. Way to over react on hearsay and limited info. Giordano deserves better then this type of rant. He has done nothing to deserve that. Shame on you. I hate when the offers and asking prices are played out in the media. It turned Boston against Hamilton. It seems to be dividing this fanbase. I haven't seen a credible quote from anyone involved in the actual negotiations. BT has remained quiet, as he should. Get him signed for what it takes, though I think it won't be near $8m. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jascgy Posted July 3, 2015 Report Share Posted July 3, 2015 Gio hasn't played since recovering from a major injury > 30 years of age. That is a fair amount of leverage for Treliving. That has to play a factor in the term and the amount. Nothing given, even for the Captain. Treliving has shrewd on his mind lately and would any deny he would depart from that? If a deal, I think 4 years at 6.6m per. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KACaribou Posted July 3, 2015 Report Share Posted July 3, 2015 There is one D getting over 8 million today. You can't pay that to a guy that will be 33 when his contract starts and who averaged just over 60 games per season the last 2 seasons. Even Giordano. Fortunately things are working in our favour. We have Hamilton so we don't need to keep Giordano. Plus, the cap hasn't went up much and isn't projected to next season. Teams aren't handing out crazy contracts. Nobody is paying Giordano 8+ on a term contract next summer. Winter is a pain, but he isn't stupid. Gio wants to stay here. He also wants to win here, not shackle the team. A deal will get done that works for both parties. If I am the Flames, my "walk away" number is 7.5 x 5. Maybe even 7 x 4. If you can't get there you trade him. That isn't a threat to force a bargain. It is what we can afford to pay him, take it or leave it. Way to over react on hearsay and limited info. Giordano deserves better then this type of rant. He has done nothing to deserve that. Shame on you. I have read your self-rightousness before. You don't know Gio, don't act like he's family. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmac70 Posted July 3, 2015 Report Share Posted July 3, 2015 This is where it is make or break time. Contracts of 8,9 or 10 million are what paint clubs in a corner. I like GIO but he isn't worth 8 million or 9. At best 7, 7.5 for maximum 3 years. We can not forget we went into the 2nd round without him so the club can be successful. Hamilton is the next stud dman in our organization. Heart and soul guys are not greedy, 7 million is a great number fro everyone. Shows team composure and wanting to win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kehatch Posted July 3, 2015 Report Share Posted July 3, 2015 I have read your self-rightousness before. You don't know Gio, don't act like he's family. You do? He was one of the biggest reasons for our turn around. Attacking him because of a rumor negotiations started at a specific number is ridiculous. This is where it is make or break time. Contracts of 8,9 or 10 million are what paint clubs in a corner. I like GIO but he isn't worth 8 million or 9. At best 7, 7.5 for maximum 3 years. We can not forget we went into the 2nd round without him so the club can be successful. Hamilton is the next stud dman in our organization. Heart and soul guys are not greedy, 7 million is a great number fro everyone. Shows team composure and wanting to win. If it doesn't look like we can sign him I wonder if a deal involving him and Shattenkirk is available. It sounds like the Blues are looking for a shake up to take them to the next level. Gio could do that for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted July 3, 2015 Report Share Posted July 3, 2015 This is where it is make or break time. Contracts of 8,9 or 10 million are what paint clubs in a corner. I like GIO but he isn't worth 8 million or 9. At best 7, 7.5 for maximum 3 years. We can not forget we went into the 2nd round without him so the club can be successful. Hamilton is the next stud dman in our organization. Heart and soul guys are not greedy, 7 million is a great number fro everyone. Shows team composure and wanting to win. I agree, except that you don't walk away from your captain. I don't think you actually suggested that, though. You pay him and trade him when a successor rises to the top, if the price ever becomes an issue. I think you structure a deal that declines sufficiently enough to lower the cap hit. I really don't follow the whole recapture bit, but you want to stay away from that in the case he retires before the end of the contract. Is it based on a 35+ contract or when a player reaches 35? Anyway, if you did something like 9,9,7,7,5,5 that would be $7m. Gio gets paid big dollaros for his best years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jessemadnote39 Posted July 3, 2015 Report Share Posted July 3, 2015 I had a couple thoughts: 1. These same talking heads had Hamilton rumoured to be asking for 7.5 and Backlund looking for 5.25 so I would take this several grains of salt. 2. Why do we as fans care about the structure of these deals, isn't all that matters the AAV when it comes to cap hit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDeeds Posted July 3, 2015 Report Share Posted July 3, 2015 I had a couple thoughts: 1. These same talking heads had Hamilton rumoured to be asking for 7.5 and Backlund looking for 5.25 so I would take this several grains of salt. 2. Why do we as fans care about the structure of these deals, isn't all that matters the AAV when it comes to cap hit? 1. Asking price is not usually what a player sticks to with unless he wants out. Gio has indicated he wants to stay so he eliminated that bargaining chip. Start high and let the price fall to what you really want is likely the tactic here. 2. All the armchair GM's around here and you are surprised most think they know how to deal with this situation? BT has managed to sign most players lately(this off season) to realistic and value contracts. I expect him to find common ground on Gio's contract too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmac70 Posted July 3, 2015 Report Share Posted July 3, 2015 I agree, except that you don't walk away from your captain. I don't think you actually suggested that, though. You pay him and trade him when a successor rises to the top, if the price ever becomes an issue. I think you structure a deal that declines sufficiently enough to lower the cap hit. I really don't follow the whole recapture bit, but you want to stay away from that in the case he retires before the end of the contract. Is it based on a 35+ contract or when a player reaches 35? Anyway, if you did something like 9,9,7,7,5,5 that would be $7m. Gio gets paid big dollaros for his best years. We agree to disagree. I have no issue signing him to 7 million max 7.5 but he is not a $9 mill player, that type of money is for franchise guys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTech780 Posted July 3, 2015 Report Share Posted July 3, 2015 Ryan O'Reilly may have just started a really interesting trend that most likely will get fixed in the next CBA. He signed a 7 year contract with an AAV of $7.5Mill, what is really interesting about the contract is that his salary is only $1mill per season the rest is signing bonus. There is no real benefit to the club, but the player gets around paying escrow. I wonder if this can be used as a negotiation tactic by the teams to try and get players to sign lesser AAV's as they won't be losing as much money to escrow. I put this here as this could be a tactic to get Giordano's cap hit down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.