Suggestion: Phil Kessel

[Flyerfan52]

Honestly guys, Kessel should be given some very serious consideration.

 

Backlund / Sven and the 2015 1st - that is three first round picks for Kessel and also the kind of deal a rebuilding Leafs team should want.

1 dimentional winger (least important position). $8 X 8 hit.

 

I see Backlund as a decent 3rd C, Sven as a maybe & our 1st as mid to late so not a heck of a lot for a player.

I personally see Kessel as a waste of cap. I think the same of all coasters that rely on their team to make them look good but really just care to pad their own stats.

[Flame111]

Or he whips him into shape in practice and into an even better player  

 

Fair enough FF - again I expect a really good deal. i am not selling the farm for him... And whatever the trade is I do expect the Leafs to retain some degree of Cap. It would not do well for the Flames to have a player making so much more - so the Leafs retain several million. 

Again the deal has to be right... 

Also Iggy was as a player fairly one-dimensional as well. He did not have a two-way game either. Anyway, I'll let it go... The Leafs must retain some degree of cap for me to be on board with the trade. 

 

[jjgallow]

1 dimentional winger (least important position). $8 X 8 hit.

 

I see Backlund as a decent 3rd C, Sven as a maybe & our 1st as mid to late so not a heck of a lot for a player.

I personally see Kessel as a waste of cap. I think the same of all coasters that rely on their team to make them look good but really just care to pad their own stats.

 

+1    (something that doesn't show up on Kessel's stats most game nights)

[JTech780]

1 dimentional winger (least important position). $8 X 8 hit.

I see Backlund as a decent 3rd C, Sven as a maybe & our 1st as mid to late so not a heck of a lot for a player.

I personally see Kessel as a waste of cap. I think the same of all coasters that rely on their team to make them look good but really just care to pad their own stats.

I agree if a winger is your highest paid player, you have constructed your team poorly.

This team is where it is this year based on hard work and team work. It has been well documented that Kessel doesn't work hard when he doesn't have the puck. Everyone has to be working hard and pulling the rope in the same direction for this team succeed.

[JTech780]

http://www.thehockeynews.com/blog/rumor-roundup-next-moves-for-maple-leafs-could-include-trades-of-phaneuf-kessel-bozak/

Kessel has a limited NTC where can name 8 teams he'll accept a trade to, I would be surprised if Calgary was on his list.

[kehatch]

Gaborik, Hossa, P Kane ... all guys that could face similar criticism to Kessel.  All guys that were a major part of their team winning the cup.  Iginla, Fleury, .....

 

You need wingers.  Kessel is an elite scorer and he can be a difference maker.  

[JTech780]

Gaborik, Hossa, P Kane ... all guys that could face similar criticism to Kessel. All guys that were a major part of their team winning the cup. Iginla, Fleury, .....

You need wingers. Kessel is an elite scorer and he can be a difference maker.

Hossa is one of the top two way players in the NHL, he was also signed as a UFA.

Gaborik was had for Matt Frattin and 2 2nds. Not near the cost of what has been rumoured for Kessel.

Both Hossa and Gaborik were added to teams that were already cup contenders.

Scoring wingers are available in UFA or for cheap via trade every year, there is no reason to overpay to get one.

[kehatch]

Hossa is one of the top two way players in the NHL, he was also signed as a UFA.

Gaborik was had for Matt Frattin and 2 2nds. Not near the cost of what has been rumoured for Kessel.

Both Hossa and Gaborik were added to teams that were already cup contenders.

Scoring wingers are available in UFA or for cheap via trade every year, there is no reason to overpay to get one.

 

I don't agree that guys like Kessel aren't available for cheap every year.  I do agree that they can be found much easier then top C or D.  But unless you get luck, chances are you are going to have to pay to get them.

[robrob1974]

Gaborik, Hossa, P Kane ... all guys that could face similar criticism to Kessel.  All guys that were a major part of their team winning the cup.  Iginla, Fleury, .....

 

You need wingers.  Kessel is an elite scorer and he can be a difference maker.  

 

I don't see Kessel as a difference maker. I think he turtles too much. And instead of running with the comments of him being a coaching nightmare and showing people otherwise, what has he done to change the Leaf's fortunes?

[kehatch]

I don't see Kessel as a difference maker. I think he turtles too much. And instead of running with the comments of him being a coaching nightmare and showing people otherwise, what has he done to change the Leaf's fortunes?

 

People say that all the time about these players though.  People were totally against going after Carter for example for many of the same reasons listed here.  

 

Of course he has warts.  Any player you acquire outside of the draft has warts.  Otherwise they wouldn't be available.  Fans spend a lot of time pointing out why a player isn't perfect.  Often to see that player do very well with the team that picks him up.  

[robrob1974]

He also has such a elbowing attitude. He and Phaneuf seem like the same player. I don't want that here.

 

I agree with you about the warts. But it's the work ethic and the "oh woe is me" attitude that screams loser to me. We're trying to build a winner here. 

 

I think the only players I wanted off the Leaf's roster are Van Reimsdyk and Franson. Franson is gone now, and Van Reimsdyk will cost a bit to take. 

I thought that Carter's attitude had more to do with both Richards' and Carter's party boy lifestyles. Their will to win was second to none and helped bring Philly to the finals. 

[cross16]

Gaborik, Hossa, P Kane ... all guys that could face similar criticism to Kessel.  All guys that were a major part of their team winning the cup.  Iginla, Fleury, .....

 

You need wingers.  Kessel is an elite scorer and he can be a difference maker.  

Big difference for me between Kessel and those 3, compete level. The 3 you mention you would never question their compete whereas Kessel you constantly question it.

[jjgallow]

Of course he has warts.  Any player you acquire outside of the draft has warts.  Otherwise they wouldn't be available.  Fans spend a lot of time pointing out why a player isn't perfect.  Often to see that player do very well with the team that picks him up.  

 

Gary Leeman.

[DirtyDeeds]

Gary Leeman.

Not many have the umm "pucks" to mention that name around these parts....

 

[cccsberg]

Minimum Price of Brodie, Monohan and a first.

Your valuations are way off. In this grouping of players I'd put Kessel as the third best of the bunch.

[The_People1]

I'm necromancing this thread because, well, i suggested we trade for Phil Kessel last season and pretty much got laughed at.

 

What would it have costed us?  Maybe Sven Baertschi, maybe the 1st rounder which we turned into Dougie Hamilton (who appears to be quite a work in progress at the moment), maybe more, maybe less. Who knows but watching him basically lead the Penguins to the Cup, what are everyone's thoughts now?

 

Some may still be against the trade due to the cost at the time, which is fair.  but some of you have to at least take back these comments. Especially, MAC331, Phaneuf + Kessel for Thornton + Marleau?  Lol got two things majorly wrong at the same time.  Only kehatch and Flames111 saw Kessel as a talent the Flames should have been interested in getting.

 

Wouldn't touch him at any cost. It's not a talent thing at all as he is one of the most talented players in the NHL but I've read so much more about his attitude and work ethic and he is not a guy who can lead a team...

Not a hope in hell we touch this clown, he would be a cancer in the dressing room. 

No thanks. Whether you choose to believe the media on Kessel or not the simple fact is that he is a floater. I've watched enough games to see this is evidently clear. No doubt he is talented and its scary to think what he could do if he put in the effort game in and game out but he doesn't.

From limited times I've watched the Laughs he seems to a floater, whiner, diver and prima donna.

Let him languish with TML

Kessel would not be able to be in the physical condition Hartley would demand. Of course if he did, with Kessel's natural born talent he'd be heading for the Hall of Fame. Unfortunately I don't see this guy doing anything more than what he does. He's got a surfer mentality in the middle of winter. 

If TOR was smart they would try and work a deal with the Sharks: Phaneuf and Kessell for Thorton and Marleau, both teams need a shake up.

No thanks we don't need a cancerous player like fat Phil

I'd pass. He's a whiner...

 

I just don't see us winning the cup with him, nor do I see him ever winning one.

 

[kehatch]

I'm necromancing this thread because, well, i suggested we trade for Phil Kessel last season and pretty much got laughed at.

What would it have costed us? Maybe Sven Baertschi, maybe the 1st rounder which we turned into Dougie Hamilton (who appears to be quite a work in progress at the moment), maybe more, maybe less. Who knows but watching him basically lead the Penguins to the Cup, what are everyone's thoughts now?

Some may still be against the trade due to the cost at the time, which is fair. but some of you have to at least take back these comments. Especially, MAC331, Phaneuf + Kessel for Thornton + Marleau? Lol got two things majorly wrong at the same time. Only kehatch and Flames111 saw Kessel as a talent the Flames should have been interested in getting.

I was with you in being interested. That said, we just finished bottom 5 while Pittsburgh won the cup. Kessel doesn't bridge that gap for us. It is very possible that if we did make the trade someone else would be reviving this thread to tell the three of us how wrong we were.

[cccsberg]

I'm necromancing this thread because, well, i suggested we trade for Phil Kessel last season and pretty much got laughed at.

 

What would it have costed us?  Maybe Sven Baertschi, maybe the 1st rounder which we turned into Dougie Hamilton (who appears to be quite a work in progress at the moment), maybe more, maybe less. Who knows but watching him basically lead the Penguins to the Cup, what are everyone's thoughts now?

 

Some may still be against the trade due to the cost at the time, which is fair.  but some of you have to at least take back these comments. Especially, MAC331, Phaneuf + Kessel for Thornton + Marleau?  Lol got two things majorly wrong at the same time.  Only kehatch and Flames111 saw Kessel as a talent the Flames should have been interested in getting.

Hmmm..... must have been on holidays or something to avoid that list of comments.....  Actually, I think Kessel is just fine as a player, but not interested as it wasn't a good fit for the Flames, just like Stamkos probably isn't a good fit for us this summer either.  

 

PS: After many "discussions" with my wife over many irrelevant things, I've learned that arguing over who is 'right' and shoving that stuff into another's face doesn't really get you too far in the world, probably not too helpful on blogs either......

[JTech780]

I'm necromancing this thread because, well, i suggested we trade for Phil Kessel last season and pretty much got laughed at.

 

What would it have costed us?  Maybe Sven Baertschi, maybe the 1st rounder which we turned into Dougie Hamilton (who appears to be quite a work in progress at the moment), maybe more, maybe less. Who knows but watching him basically lead the Penguins to the Cup, what are everyone's thoughts now?

 

Some may still be against the trade due to the cost at the time, which is fair.  but some of you have to at least take back these comments. Especially, MAC331, Phaneuf + Kessel for Thornton + Marleau?  Lol got two things majorly wrong at the same time.  Only kehatch and Flames111 saw Kessel as a talent the Flames should have been interested in getting.

 

Just because Kessel won a Cup with Pittsburgh doesn't mean he would've been a good fit here. The guy was playing on the 3rd line. Pittsburgh could hide him behind Crosby and Malkin 2 of the biggest names in the sport. In Calgary Kessel would've had to be the guy or he would have been seen as the guy and that is not his strong suit. 

 

Not only that he would have eaten a large chunk of our cap this year. He wouldn't be able to play with Gaudreau or Bennett as he can't play with other players who like to carry the puck hence why he ended up on the 3rd line.

 

So I still don't see the fit for him here.

 

I mean good on the guy for being part of the team that won the Cup, but he was only a part of the team he didn't lead his team to the Cup.

[robrob1974]

I'm necromancing this thread because, well, i suggested we trade for Phil Kessel last season and pretty much got laughed at.

 

What would it have costed us?  Maybe Sven Baertschi, maybe the 1st rounder which we turned into Dougie Hamilton (who appears to be quite a work in progress at the moment), maybe more, maybe less. Who knows but watching him basically lead the Penguins to the Cup, what are everyone's thoughts now?

 

Some may still be against the trade due to the cost at the time, which is fair.  but some of you have to at least take back these comments. Especially, MAC331, Phaneuf + Kessel for Thornton + Marleau?  Lol got two things majorly wrong at the same time.  Only kehatch and Flames111 saw Kessel as a talent the Flames should have been interested in getting.

 

Are you boardinging serious? 

 

He won the cup on a team that boasted Crosby and Malkin, PLAYING ON THE boardingING 3RD LINE. On the 3rd line he's not getting the same caliber checkers. You're an idiot...

[The_People1]

I was with you in being interested. That said, we just finished bottom 5 while Pittsburgh won the cup. Kessel doesn't bridge that gap for us. It is very possible that if we did make the trade someone else would be reviving this thread to tell the three of us how wrong we were.

 

Not sure what gap you are referring.   Kessel would not win us a Cup this season but we missed the playoffs by only 5-wins and he could've helped towards the Flames making the playoffs.  Where we agreed most is that he's a good player who could have been had at a discount, at the time.  I think we both saw good value and saw a good opportunity to add a piece to the Flames that may have been a good fit.

 

Toronto went from 5th worse to 1st worst after losing Kessel.  And Kessel contributed big time on Pittsburgh's Cup win.   Kessel is an impact player and i think the Flames missed out on an opportunity to add a good piece to the lineup.

 

PS: After many "discussions" with my wife over many irrelevant things, I've learned that arguing over who is 'right' and shoving that stuff into another's face doesn't really get you too far in the world, probably not too helpful on blogs either......

 

I don't think i was necessarily right or wrong.  Even in hindsight, i may still be wrong about suggesting the Flames acquire Kessel because he may not have helped the Flames get into the playoffs.  We will never know.  It's just interesting to read through some of the comments from others at the time of the suggestion now that Kessel has his name on the Cup.

 

Just because Kessel won a Cup with Pittsburgh doesn't mean he would've been a good fit here. The guy was playing on the 3rd line. Pittsburgh could hide him behind Crosby and Malkin 2 of the biggest names in the sport. In Calgary Kessel would've had to be the guy or he would have been seen as the guy and that is not his strong suit. 

 

Not only that he would have eaten a large chunk of our cap this year. He wouldn't be able to play with Gaudreau or Bennett as he can't play with other players who like to carry the puck hence why he ended up on the 3rd line.

 

So I still don't see the fit for him here.

 

I mean good on the guy for being part of the team that won the Cup, but he was only a part of the team he didn't lead his team to the Cup.

 

Well, Kessel found the best chemistry with Bonino and Hagelin. Maybe the Flames equivalent of that is Backlund and Frolik.  Or maybe the Flames don't have the right fit at all.

 

Kessel led statistically if not outright led through example over the course of the playoffs.  He averaged 17:46-mins per game in the playoffs which ranks 5th overall with the Pens.  Only Crosby averaged more minutes as a forward.  Kessel's usage and minutes suggests his line was at least the "second line" but really, the Pens rolled the top 3 lines fairly equally throughout the playoffs. Not to mention, 2nd and 3rd lines are generally used in two-way situations to allow the 1st line the main scoring responsibilities.  To see Kessel excel offensively in a two-way situation is impressive.

 

Are you @#$% serious? 

 

He won the cup on a team that boasted Crosby and Malkin, PLAYING ON THE @#$% 3RD LINE. On the 3rd line he's not getting the same caliber checkers. You're an idiot...

 

Yes, seriously.  You were half-right though.  You're not going to see Kessel win the Cup with the Flames.  The Flames will win it without him.

[cross16]

Kessel went exactly where he needed to go, a market where he didn't need to be a leader and he could just be Phil. I think Kessel is at best when he isn't the guy, isn't a leader and he can be strategically utilized to maximize offence. That wouldn't have happened here, he needed the right fit and got it. Let's remember he was terrible for a good chunk of the regular season too so it's not like this is the slam dunk you are making it out to be.

Not to mention be likely cost the flames Bennett. Problem with the flames is they don't have a prospect near the calibre of Kapanen so to match the leafs deal they likely need to include him. That and/or a top 10 pick because IMO having Kessel wouldn't have changed much last year nor do I agree they make the playoffs with him. Not unless he is a goalie in his spare time.

For me Kessel winning a cup doesn't change anything I said. He was and is still not someone the flames should have targeted. Good target and good move for pens but not for flames.

[cccsberg]

 

I don't think i was necessarily right or wrong.  Even in hindsight, i may still be wrong about suggesting the Flames acquire Kessel because he may not have helped the Flames get into the playoffs.  We will never know.  It's just interesting to read through some of the comments from others at the time of the suggestion now that Kessel has his name on the Cup.

 

You're correct.  Now, where are the past comments about Schultz who also has his name on the Cup?

[Flyerfan52]

For me Kessel winning a cup doesn't change anything I said. He was and is still not someone the flames should have targeted. Good target and good move for pens but not for flames.

Same. The Pens had a spot where he wasn't "the guy" while in Calgary (or ant Canadian city) he would have remained in the spotlight.

Even with the salary retained we don't have 6.8 cap space sitting idle & the equal in players given up would hurt us more as we are building towards a SC while the Pens were trying to get 1 while they still had those core players they ditched so hard for. Now they are in serious cap trouble & the outlook of a flat/minimal raise or even drop in the total leaves them in a worse place than Chicago after their cup wins as the Hawks had good complimentary players to trade in years where the cap was expected to rise.

You're correct.  Now, where are the past comments about Schultz who also has his name on the Cup?

[The_People1]

Ya good call on J.Schultz. I haven't change my mind on his iffy play but would certainly have to take back comments about him never winning a Cup if I ever did say that.