conundrumed

That news was, like, a month ago. We all knew it.lol

I follow the Wings, so I've watched the player tons. My opinion is that I don't appreciate you running down a player that you know zero about. If you want to talk Satoshi Nakamoto about him, I'll defend him. That's how opinions work. It's not about "having the right", it's about calling BS when I see it. Your initial post is BS in my opinion. My opinion is based on knowing the player and I'm fulling saying that you don't.. But you aren't backing down. You're doubling down. So what, now you're playing the victim card? Rather than just say maybe you overreacted? Joe Veleno isn't a dirty player, plain and simple. This is a silly hill to die on. Stop being bombastic is all. I was major surprised that Veleno did that and can really only surmise that it wasn't his intention. That was waaaay out of his character. Not even close. There is zero doubt in my mind that he didn't intentionally land on Nino's leg.

NOW imagine Reinbacher falls to 16 and we have 16 & 17. Satoshi Nakamoto just got real with our D prospects!! Perchance to dream.lol

Whatever. If you have no idea what you're talking about, use your inside voice. You're running down a player that you've never watched over a 3 second clip. Quit while you're behind. It's quite apparent that you have zero insight into the player, but you have "tons of evidence" in a tiny, tiny, TINY snippet. That's what you're going to run with...it's laughable bordering pathetic. But you do you.

And how often have you watched him play, dare I ask? And you likely didn't read my, *what may have happened there*. You may want to loosen up on your judge, jury and executioner style of opinion. Particularly about players you appear to know nothing about.

BS post. If you don't know the player, don't have an opinion based on an incident that was undoubtedly an accident. Veleno has zero history of that kind of play. What is more likely is Veleno wanted to jar Nino's skate to free the puck but sadly misjudged where the skate landed. If you've watched him play enough, you'd know that isn't his style, rather than getting all holy about a player that you know little about. And triggering me.lol

There's a massive difference in working in partnership with Shanahan vs owners that hire their goldenboy coach.

I ran the Lindholm for 17th oa, Veleno and Wallinder scenario on the Wings board and here's the summary of responses: -Looooove Lindholm, but he's about 2 years too old. But perfect fit. -Wallinder is almost a non-starter, only behind Edvinsson for prospects, but we're rich on D. -Would need a sign and trade or affirmation it's not a 1 year rental Generally, some posters are staunchly, "no more players over 25-26yo". I've had those arguments in other threads. "Larkin is on record saying having no one around him to help him hurt a lot". They don't seem to have an exit strategy. Every year they say, "we're 2 years away".lol Then get angry during the season... The more thoughtful posters only have an issue with age, but some are arguing that Lindholm will age well due to his skating, his style of play and that he can move to RW eventually. If Lindholm were 28 next year, they'd stamp it immediately. As is, they're a little reticent but would still be okay with it. They don't love the price, but understand that would be about the price. Just for perspective on how other fans view Lindholm. As for here, the, "if we trade him will it help us make the playoffs this year" diatribe is nowhere. The idea, for me, is to retool if it came to trading him, not stay the same. We'd likely be a little more comfortable moving Hanifin. Relying on Kylington to replace him is not a good strategy imho. As for those who only know Veleno by stats, his linemates changed almost weekly, constant flux. Still developing but solid. If you want stats, go look at Chytil's, who's a year older and has consistent linemates. You may find that they are eerily similar. Chytil really just started to break out this year. They aren't the same style. Veleno is more of a workhouse. His suspension from the WC is waaay out of character. My thinking is that he completely gaffed on where he wanted his skate to land. He's a hard player, not a dirty one. And I could watch a big, skilled dman all day.lol

Why do I feel like our horrendous karma means FLA = 23 Cup champs, TML = 24 Cup champs? Sutter's "unfinished business" took the wrong fork in the road to the Blockchain around highway that leads to the perpetual city of find out?

That would be horrendous and I love Keller. Now we have no C, D has taken a hit and the waning prospect pool gets worse. As I said in the draft thread: Detroit gets Lindholm. Calgary gets 17thoa (the NJ to Van Horvat pick is Detroit's from the savvy Hronek trade), Veleno, Wallinder. Why Detroit does it: it's the perfect fit. A D-responsible RHC that can snipe is ideal. He gets crafty young Jonny Burgers on his left and possession monster Perron on his right. Both can play either side. Moves Copp to 3C so Veleno, though young, runs out of real estate. Lots of LD prospects. Why Calgary does it: Get a 23yo bonafide NHL C that plays a blue collar game to counter losing a C. Get a young, large, excellent skating puck-moving LD prospect for the pending Hanifin exit. Prop up the prospect pool as you now have 16 AND 17oa. I'm also a Detroit fan. That is a very fair offer for both sides and matches the Horvat trade easy. Detroit also has Kasper coming up at C as Perron is reaching twilight. So the potential to move Lindholm to RW over time to help groom Kasper is also huge. So if we're interviewing Tanguay, run this by him.lol

I'd be good dropping to 20 to recoup a 3rd if Musty is still there. He's potentially better than some of the 5-10 guys imho. If he doesn't reach his potential he's still an easy middle 6. Between the guys you've listed, I'd take Musty and a 3rd all day, and not because I don't like those players.

He's got a job, leave him alone.lol

He finished his SHL season last year and made it to GR for one game. His ELC starts this season. 17th, Veleno and Wallinder would literally be prying Lindholm from Calgary. That little fantasy trade won't happen but it's likely perfect for both teams. Detroit gets the best player, Calgary gets a young C, a potential Hanifin replacement that is 6'4" and an excellent skater/puck mover, and a solid boost to the prospect pool at 17th. Detroit's LD is Walman, Edvinsson, Maata. Johansson ready for the NHL, Viro, Sebrango, McIsaac. Shai Buium in university. So still lots, gotta give to get. Horvat wouldn't have been a great fit, but Lindholm is almost ideal. Wouldn't solve the Flames issues, but would definitely soften the blow and provide some latitude for moving on from Hanifin/Kylington. Flames fans would hate it.lol

1g, 1a, +2 in the Memorial Cup opener vs Peterborough, a 6-3 win. He's a big boy!!

That was pretty much the price for Horvat at the tdl as a pending ufa. So Lindholm should command a bit more to get a full year in. I think that's a bit more and meets a few things for us. A young replacement center that is an NHLer, a potential Hanifin/Kylington replacement and a great prospect at 17. Although I'm dreaming, I don't know what more we'd expect to get for Lindholm. And again, we're absolutely terrified to make a trade. So we won't make one regardless. We are in longterm marriages that can't end without pandemonium and black eyes.lol Rather than, you know, just be level-headed and leave emotion out of it. That would be a nice change.

Rather than stats, the eye test puts Veleno ahead of Rozie by a fair bit. Wallinder is also fairly close, try a year in the A, but a likely Hanifin replacement candidate. He's been fairly a stud in the SHL at a young age.

How well will that 8yrs age is the real question. We are really running into these, "stay until you're 38yo" contracts. In a few short years we'll have 26-30mil tied up in guys on the wrong side of 32. It could become paralyzing.

23yo C who is currently a 3C. And Wallinder is a large skilled LD. Veleno is a much more solid 200' C and plays a harder game. That is 2 1sts and a 2nd for practical purposes. Can't see getting more than that for Lindstrom. That's a bit better than Horvat (17th is the Horvat trade pick).

I disagree, almost completely. The draft is for addressing needs. Teams with a solid prospect pool would definitely prefer to improve with a current player. Detroit, Buffalo, NJ to name a few. Lindholm would be a massive deal for Detroit. The C/RW thing would really pound them into being a very real contender. Fabbri-Larkin-Raymond JBurgers-Lindholm-Perron Rasmussen-Copp-Kubalik Soderblom/Mazur-Suter-Luff Zadina That changes everything for Detroit. 17th oa + Veleno, done deal. Veleno is a solid 3C most days with room to grow. Detroit still has Marco Kasper coming up at C to displace Copp, or Lindy to RW. That would be wicked for Detroit. I'd even consider adding Wallinder/Viro/Sebrango. About the only thing holding Detroit back is Seider, Raymond, Berggren coming off of ELCs next year. Ryan Reeves was traded for a late 1st on the floor. Let that sink in. edit Damn, I have to stop thinking about how massive Lindholm would be for Detroit.lol Perfect offset of Larkin, who will fight anyone when he gets wild. Perfect guy to put on Kasper's RW eventually. Detroit is Swede-rich and an extremely fun city. It's not '80's Detroit that outsiders can't seem to let go of. Lindholm would love it. Veleno (RFA) softens the blow for Calgary at C, 2 1sts in a row, a good D prospect that the Wings are rich in, everybody walks away with a win. Even Veleno, who needs opportunity after developing well in a bottom 6 role. Bridge him at $3-4x3 and go. He's only 23 so there's still a lot there. Lindholm would be absolutely concise to Detroit's need, so pay a good price.

You forgot CBS added Andrew Peeke and gave us our 3rd back. Hanifin went to St, Lou for Neighbours and T.O.s 1st. Another 2nd/3rd was acquired for Vladar: Huberdeau-Kadri-Toffoli Neighbours-Sillinger-Dube Mangiapane-Backlund-Coleman Pelletier-Ruzicka-Duehr Weegar-Anderson Kylington-Tanev Z-Peeke Added prospects: Musty Ritchie Lindstein McCarthy Burns Re-tool on the fly, we have cap, we have prospects, we have a youth movement, let's go. Swap lines 2-3 as necessary, edit Forgot Cole Knuble if he's still around the Burns pick in this little fantasy world!!

Here's a superfun story made for this thread. 2 nights ago my Reddit feed had a post from this Ukrainian kid playing u15 Czechia headed for U17. He was asking people to like, follow and any advice. Here's where it got really fun. He added a link to his elite prospects profile. Yesterday he was #1 in "Trending Players" on their site (most searched). Now the kid has another 50,000+ people cheering him on to make his dream real. Aaaaand, it really doesn't look like he's bad at hockeying.lol https://www.eliteprospects.com/player/982799/myroslav-spaskin

And even that's getting a bit rich for 1 40g/ppg season that was with Gaudreau and Tkachuk. Never before, not yet after. Larkin has shown some consistency at ppg and is likely worth more, as well as being a captain. I just don't think that he's worth the full 9. Could be a 50-60pt guy again. That would suck.

He can asks whatever he likes, but I'd be pretty firm at a max of $8.5 personally. Larkin is $8.7 and would be a comparable.

Depends who you ask but maybe 22ish. He's being pretty under-the-radar imho. He's had shoulder problems but that's all been corrected. Due to missed time, it doesn't seem many are noticing that pace was about 35-65 100pts in the O. I believe he was expected to rip the doors right off this year due to his skill level but put in a lot more work on his D game. He could go anywhere from 12 to 32 honestly. He isn't getting much press like many others. He turned down the USNTDP for the O also so some likely have their panties in a bunch still. He most likely would have had Leonard's spot on that team. Instead went 1st oa in the OHL draft, so it's not like the hype has never surrounded his skills.

In regards to size, here are the players that support that we have good avg size: Markstrom Vladar Zadorov Ruzicka Hanifin Tanev Only Huberdeau as a top 9 forward is over 6' at 6'1" and he's a playmaker. This is imho why we can't really generate enough offense. We just don't have the size in fwd presence to get in the goalies face and be very physical on the forecheck like Lucic. We don't get to the dirty areas. Not much of a cycle game. I'm not saying that I want everyone to be 6'2"+, but we do need a couple of power forward types with skill because we really don't have that in prospects either. Barlow is listed either 6' or 6'1" but he plays more like a smarter Coleman with a wicked shot and even better releases. His releases are like Tkachuk with power. He changes his release angle 6 ways from Sunday. But if he gets to 9 and Detroit doesn't I'll be choked. They need a C but really need a finisher beyond Raymond. So I think Musty's a really talented LWer for us. Not just the 6'3", but his frame can really handle his height and he's a very good skater. The real charm is great hands, in or out of traffic, he's got great mitts. Also good pass/shoot reads and great at both.