RUS Posted June 22, 2012 Report Share Posted June 22, 2012 Islanders acquire Lubomir Visnovsky from Ducks for 2013 2nd rounder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyerfan52 Posted June 23, 2012 Report Share Posted June 23, 2012 Not a bad deal for the Isles. They have enough draft picks in the pipeline & Visnovsky will bring more then that @ the deadline given the current trend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ConnorFutureGM Posted June 23, 2012 Report Share Posted June 23, 2012 Not a bad deal for the Isles. They have enough draft picks in the pipeline & Visnovsky will bring more then that @ the deadline given the current trend. Might set the price for Bouwmeester. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wally31 Posted June 23, 2012 Report Share Posted June 23, 2012 Might set the price for Bouwmeester. Somewhat agree. I think a bit more though. Yes with Vis you get the offence, but you get 28 minutes of good defence with jbow, and the offence could still be there from Florida.. I think a 2nd + 4/5 young D 6/9 young forward. Who knows? ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyerfan52 Posted June 23, 2012 Report Share Posted June 23, 2012 Might set the price for Bouwmeester. If so it means a 35 year old decent D carrying a 5.6 cap hit = a 2nd. So a top 2 pairing 27 year old D @ a bit more cap hit that plays huge minutes should = a lot more. Somewhat agree. I think a bit more though. Yes with Vis you get the offence, but you get 28 minutes of good defence with jbow, and the offence could still be there from Florida.. I think a 2nd + 4/5 young D 6/9 young forward. Who knows? ! You are setting the price much to low. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ConnorFutureGM Posted June 23, 2012 Report Share Posted June 23, 2012 If so it means a 35 year old decent D carrying a 5.6 cap hit = a 2nd. So a top 2 pairing 27 year old D @ a bit more cap hit that plays huge minutes should = a lot more. You are setting the price much to low. You're looking at Bouwmeester through a grandfather's eyes. Bouwmeester is a better defender, I will give him that. The part that attracted the Islanders to Visnovsky was his cap hit to dollar value. He had a 5.6 mil cap hit but will only make a salary of 3 mil which is the type of situation floor teams want. Visnovsky is one of the better offensive defencemen in the league so lets say Visnovsky's offence cancels out Bouwmeester's defence and vice versa. That leaves other parts like contract and age in determining value. If a team is trading for a underperforming player, one would think they would want the player to be on a shorter contract so the will have more options at the end of the season depending on the players performance. The other factor is age. Bouwmeester is younger but he is already at what most people would consider his prime. Visnovsky might be on the decline but he has one more season to prove otherwise. Either way, I don't see much difference in their overall value. Right now it seems there is a large supply of defencemen available which will bring down the value. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyerfan52 Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 Visnovsky is one of the better offensive defencemen in the league so lets say Visnovsky's offence cancels out Bouwmeester's defence and vice versa. That leaves other parts like contract and age in determining value. If a team is trading for a underperforming player, one would think they would want the player to be on a shorter contract so the will have more options at the end of the season depending on the players performance. The other factor is age. Bouwmeester is younger but he is already at what most people would consider his prime. Visnovsky might be on the decline but he has one more season to prove otherwise. Either way, I don't see much difference in their overall value. Right now it seems there is a large supply of defencemen available which will bring down the value. I'll ignore your usual childish insult as it's expected. You can't say better offense #s cancel defense as that's not measurable even for you stats freaks. So you can say it but it doesn't make it true. I'm surprised you are saying the older player is the better risk as it always seems to be youth over everything with you. I guess it's because JBo is a Flame & you would never admit we have some dang good players. Please name that huge supply of defense-men available but limit it to the 1s capable of playing a top 2 role (on contenders, not those that use them as such because they are the best of a bad lot) if you intend to compare them to JBo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ConnorFutureGM Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 I'll ignore your usual childish insult as it's expected. You can't say better offense #s cancel defense as that's not measurable even for you stats freaks. So you can say it but it doesn't make it true. I'm surprised you are saying the older player is the better risk as it always seems to be youth over everything with you. I guess it's because JBo is a Flame & you would never admit we have some dang good players. Please name that huge supply of defense-men available but limit it to the 1s capable of playing a top 2 role (on contenders, not those that use them as such because they are the best of a bad lot) if you intend to compare them to JBo. I can't quantify it but one can say the impact Visnovsky has on a team offensively is comparable to the impact Bouwmeester has on a team defensively. I guess that statement is neither here nor there but if a team is looking for a big point getter from the back end they'd look for Visnovsky and if one is looking for a shutdown guy they would look to Bouwmeester. I think I'm being more than fair calling this a draw since offensive players are usually a lot more expensive than defensive players. Who the heck do you think Bouwmeester is? He is not some elite defenceman. He can't even crack 30 points. Just because the Flames play Bouwmeester on the top pairing doesn't mean he is a top pairing defenceman. Not counting UFAs: Leopold, Bouwmeester, Pitkanen, Hjalmarsson, Methot, Robidas, Kaberle, Del Zoto, Gonchar, Yandle, Martin, Boyle, Ballard, Green, Hainsey can all be had. You will tell me that Bouwmeester is on a higher level than these defencemen. Bouwmeester is an overpaid, non-physical shutdown defenceman and should be making less than 5 million per. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrippinVdUb Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 Not counting UFAs: Leopold, Bouwmeester, Pitkanen, Hjalmarsson, Methot, Robidas, Kaberle, Del Zoto, Gonchar, Yandle, Martin, Boyle, Ballard, Green, Hainsey can all be had. You will tell me that Bouwmeester is on a higher level than these defencemen. Bouwmeester is an overpaid, non-physical shutdown defenceman and should be making less than 5 million per. Being available and being available at a decent price are two different things, most of these guys are on the block because the UFA market is weak and Im guessing Gm's are trying to take advantage of that by maybe getting a little more in return then usual. And yes Jbow is on a higher level then most of these Dmen, I would take him over 3/4 of that list any day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ConnorFutureGM Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 Being available and being available at a decent price are two different things, most of these guys are on the block because the UFA market is weak and Im guessing Gm's are trying to take advantage of that by maybe getting a little more in return then usual. And yes Jbow is on a higher level then most of these Dmen, I would take him over 3/4 of that list any day. I think I would take Bouwmeester over Martin, Ballard, Kaberle and Hainsey. Bouwmeester is the best of the bunch who are overpaid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrippinVdUb Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 I think I would take Bouwmeester over Martin, Ballard, Kaberle and Hainsey. Bouwmeester is the best of the bunch who are overpaid. I would take him over all of these guys. Leopold, Pitkanen, Hjalmarsson, Methot, Robidas (maybe not 6 years ago), Kaberle, Gonchar, Martin, Ballard, Green, Hainsey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ConnorFutureGM Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 I would take him over all of these guys. Leopold, Pitkanen, Hjalmarsson, Methot, Robidas (maybe not 6 years ago), Kaberle, Gonchar, Martin, Ballard, Green, Hainsey Are you including the contract implications? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrippinVdUb Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 Are you including the contract implications? Im talking about putting the best player on the ice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zirakzigil Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 Good move by the isles. Gives them help on the blue line which they really needed and for a cheap cost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyerfan52 Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 Good move by the isles. Gives them help on the blue line which they really needed and for a cheap cost. There are stories in the east he's refusing to report to the Isles & will bolt to the KHL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrippinVdUb Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 There are stories in the east he's refusing to report to the Isles & will bolt to the KHL. Ouch, http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nhl-puck-daddy/lubomir-visnovsky-weighing-khl-vs-york-islanders-124117265--nhl.html I would hate to give up a 2nd just to see your guy bolt to the KHL (Radulov anyone?) they have to find a way to put a stop to this kind of stuff, It really is a black eye on the sport! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zirakzigil Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 There are stories in the east he's refusing to report to the Isles & will bolt to the KHL. And I have also read articles stating he is excited to go play for a young and improving team. We shall see come September what is the truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ConnorFutureGM Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 Visnovsky would be an idiot if he walked out on the last year of his contract. I predict he'll have a good seaon with the Islanders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyerfan52 Posted June 24, 2012 Report Share Posted June 24, 2012 And I have also read articles stating he is excited to go play for a young and improving team. We shall see come September what is the truth. Trippin linked 1 that shows what I stated. Please name or link the articles you read. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zirakzigil Posted June 25, 2012 Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 Trippin linked 1 that shows what I stated. Please name or link the articles you read. Ive heard a bunch Ill have to go digging. It was translated from one he gave to a local reporter at his home though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDeeds Posted June 25, 2012 Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 You're looking at Bouwmeester through a grandfather's eyes. ............ Visnovsky is one of the better offensive defencemen in the league so....... While he may have been one of the better offensive defencemen in the league in the past, his more recent history shows me otherwise. Last year he was only 51st among Defencemen in Offense(points) a huge drop by well over 50%. -----> The fact that you are trying hard to say his offense cancels out JBos better defense is almost laughable because JBO managed more total points 29(45th) last season abeit with a few more games played. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDeeds Posted June 25, 2012 Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 I could be failing in my memory but if he did bolt for a year to the KHL, doesn't his contract go on hold and the remaining amount of time on it stay with the club who holds that contract? Seems to me the remaining time from when he left still has to be fulfilled should he ever return. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyerfan52 Posted June 25, 2012 Report Share Posted June 25, 2012 I could be failing in my memory but if he did bolt for a year to the KHL, doesn't his contract go on hold and the remaining amount of time on it stay with the club who holds that contract? Seems to me the remaining time from when he left still has to be fulfilled should he ever return. I know that applies to players on EL. I'm not sure about other circumstances. I remember Jagr was UFA when he left & so was Yashin (as a result of the buyout still applied to the Isles cap hit). Both could come back anytime as UFA (there was talk the Isles might try to bring Yashin back last year. ). But Visnovsky has 25 of the 28 million from that 5 year contract & he's 35. If he does bolt he probably doesn't plan to come back to the NHL anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.